Time and Space | In Quest of Truth - Babaji Q&A, No. 260

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Time and Space | In Quest of Truth - Babaji Q&A, No. 260
Recorded on 7 February 2026 with worldwide participants

0:00 Intro
0:27 Are time and space two different things, or are they thoughts and perceptions?
2:41 Can the mind go beyond time?
3:59 The story of Leelavati from the Yoga Vasistha in the context of the discovery of entangled particles in quantum mechanics.
15:00 Is the mind, consciousness and space one and the same thing?
19:21 When a Yogi attains Self Realisation, how is that awareness beyond time and space?
21:44 What is the status of the mind of the Self-Realised Yogi?
23:43 When one becomes space, where is god then?
26:34 The universe is expanding, so the space is also expanding?
28:54 How does this existence of pure consciousness take the form of an object?
31:25 What is the cause of the separation from the pure consciousness and how to go back?
34:21 Is our existence the same as the supreme conscious energy, but because of the mind we suffer in duality?
37:04 As there are fewer thoughts in meditation, is the perception of time less?
39:45 In Tapas is it a thrilling thing as one becomes aware of the Self?
41:50 Is it true that the past, present and future occur simultaneously - and we cannot change the predetermined incidents in our life.  Thus what is the purpose of time and space?
45:35 Is the mind and the consciousness the same entity, and who or what creates the illusion, is it a different entity or is it the mind itself?
48:19 How do we understand that the universe is timeless?
51:00 Is there a need to study science as it has increased understanding of the universe?
55:22 Science as a quest for the truth of existence.
57:07 If god is the god of love, what is left of love in the space of silence?
58:27 What is the state of the mind in a dreamless deep sleep?

___
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Website: http://www.srby.org
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/shivarudrabalayogi
Twitter: https://twitter.com/SRBYmission
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Transcript

Discourse: In Quest of Truth – online Q&A no.260
 Time and Space
You tube Link: https://youtu.be/31VEMcsb3Z0 
Recorded: 07 February 2026

Start of Questions and Answers

Mata Ambaji:   Baba, Pranaams at Your Lotus Feet, Pranaams at the Lotus Feet of Guru Maharaj Shivabalayogi.  Thank You for giving me this opportunity to ask You questions.  Baba, today's topic is desha-kaala, or kaala-desha, time and space.  Baba, on the earth, the time exists, but the same object where it leaves the earth, time has no meaning.  But when we are on to the earth, we have a life span, and we calculate every object, including our physical body, in relation to time and space.  So, what is Your comment Baba?  Is time and space two different things, or they are just thoughts and perceptions? 

Babaji Maharaj:   Both are thought and perception that we have adopted for our convenience, communication and understanding in this world while we are alive, we move around.  So, such a distance, such a time, appearance and disappearance from one object to another object, that is the distance that we have adopted.  So, this is, as you told, very necessary for this world, for communication and understanding.  But when we merge with the Self, or just like when you go to the center of the space, all the directions, everything loses its effect.  In the same way, when we merge with Self-realization of the Ultimate Truth, everything merges there.  That is why the Ultimate Truth is also known as Mahakaleshwar.  He is the Lord of all the times, time that we have adopted, who consumes everything and gives us the liberation from all imaginations and such assumptions that we would have adopted, which could be giving us emotional stress, happiness, unhappiness, like dualities at all times.  So, this is my opinion.  

Mata Ambaji:   So, Baba, You are saying that if the mind… because objects are always in duality, means if it is an object, it will always be in duality.  So, if the mind knows to go beyond objectifying itself, it can go beyond the time?  

Babaji Maharaj:   Yes.  Once it realizes that through imagination, a truth doesn't get revealed fully or a hundred percent.  For that, you have to go for that.  When you go for that, you transcend the time and space barriers.  Because all imaginations come within the time and space barriers only.  So, when we have to stop the imagination, with that imagination stopping, time and space also disappears in our mind, in our assumptions, in our calculations, everything.  

Mata Ambaji:   Baba, in Yoga Vashista, there is this story of Lilavati, which always affects my mind, because in that story of Lilavati, it says that Lilavati's husband has passed away.  And she is crying and crying and crying, forgetting everything around her, her children, her household.  And even she has forgotten that she has a boon from Goddess Saraswati that she can travel to different dimensions.  So, this is why I am saying, because when she travelled to a different dimension which was beyond the earth, means which is beyond the earth and in a different galaxy, she realizes that her husband is there.  And husband, he’s alive there, he has a family.  So, both roles, in another galaxy her husband was there, and in this galaxy which holds the earth – two roles are simultaneously playing.  

Baba, why I am asking, because recently I read something which was like a very amazing thing to me.  In 2022, this Nobel Prize has been given to this person who has proven about this quantum entanglement.  There are two particles that exist simultaneously – one could be on the earth and one could be in some other galaxy.  And they move parallelly; they're entangled, they're entangled with each other.  So, when I read about that scientific theory, I just could not believe that our rishis, though it wasn't proven in the scientific lab, they understood that in two different galaxies, two objects simultaneously can work.  And one is related to the other, but not to the perception of human mind, or with the human eyes.  

Babaji Maharaj:   You see, say for humanity, it is used to the time and space calculation of this dimension, let us take, in which they are living.  Based on that only, in the mind of Lilavati, it was eight days before that her husband passed away, and eight days were spent in her calculation.  For the same time limit, the calculation and the growth of the body or the physical objects could be totally different in a different dimension.  Here also sometimes different creatures, humans or animals, its growth and its time, its quick finishing; amazing sometimes.  Like we humans take long time, we come out of the womb of the mother, and slowly we pick up any words and walking, picking up any such things.  But if you see the cow and its calf, within an hour it starts standing up, it starts running everywhere, as soon as it is born.  It doesn't need that much of time.  And it doesn't stay that much of time like humanity also.  

Like different time dimensions have come into effect.  Whatever is in your mind, the perception, that appears to be true.  What is needed in that also, in that story of Lilavati also, we should not bind ourselves to the dimension of this calculation only.  Some other consciousness which would have dropped or departed from the physical body, based on its illusory effects, it could have adopted some other illusion, some other world and some other dimension and some other time also.  That consciousness would have experienced all the forty years there.  Those forty years are only eight days experienced by his wife who is still alive in the body.  So, thus, once the consciousness goes out of the body, it loses touch of the last dimension, everything, all memory, everything is gone with the death of the brain; that I have always told.  As long as it is in touch with the brain only, the memory is there.  Once that soul drops the physical body, the brain dies, so then the consciousness or soul, whatever you want to adopt the name, that individual soul, anything, spins and based on its intensity of thoughts…  

These intensity of thoughts, it's very difficult to calculate or grasp, such is the power of illusion.  The quickness, the instincts or the time or the things that can pose into, push into another dimension based on its own imaginations, creativity.  We would like to use the word ‘creativity’ because if we go on using ‘imagination,’ people might consider it as an ordinary thing, “O, after all an imagination.”  It has such power.  If the mind itself has such power, imagine the highest consciousness when it has created the universe.  Like this, illusion inside an illusion, inside an illusion, like mind boggling dimensions have happened.  We might get excited when we realize two particles in different dimensions simultaneously may be there.  Like this also, the same consciousness is there.  So, for Lilavati, in her consciousness, she is seeing both dimension’s time limit.  Eight days she saw her husband's body, forty years she's seeing her husband's next birth.  Finally, He explains all this happens in illusion only; nothing is in truth.  So, when it happens in illusion, sky is the limit.  It can spin into any way, in any time, any type of things.  

Suppose, sitting in one hour on a chair, if you start daydreaming so deeply, you forget that you are sitting and daydreaming and you get obsessed with that.  That's what your mind creates, then and there itself; it could be creating a world, a dimension, something fantastic, something amazing, which is impossible in this dimension.  So, all such things, it can picturize.  When it is picturizing, for that, the timing is like that, it would have crossed the dimensions of time dimensions of this dimension.  So, it all happens in creativity, illusion.  So, He explains, finally, the essential value that is given by Saraswati’s teaching to Leelavati is that whatever you are crying is happening in your mind only.  Then and there it is spinning and it is creating such a calamity for yourself.  Whereas, that thing for which you have been crying and you have never seen it; the body is there itself.  But that thing that which you are visualizing to be your husband, it is somewhere else in its own illusion and it is in its own time dimension and it has forgotten about you at all.  All this you are also seeing.  This is all in your imagination.  Simply you need to overcome all these imaginations and settle back to your real Self.  That is the teaching that is given there.  So, this is where we would like to go.  

   As one side, you are talking about the scientific or astronomical calculations theories, amazing thing that is happening.  It is amazing, definitely.  A yogi would always already know the amazing thing, that is why the ancient sages experiencing all these different dimensions during their tapas time also; an astral travel type of experiences happens.  But if a yogi's final goal is Self-realization, settling in the Self, into the Truth, not getting involved going on and on into these dimensions, which are all simply created things, which is to be recognized as illusions, which has no existence value, only an appearance value.  But this appearance value also, amazing, mind-boggling.  It can be a hair-raising effect.  Even one part of that also, if you understand, it is such a wonder, amazing.  That is why they called that Truth to be boundless, anantha.  Achintya mahima samarthya, means, which you cannot think in your mind or limit, what are the capabilities of that Ultimate Truth, what all it can create, in which dimensions in which way it can create is really amazing!  It is not an ordinary thing.  I have always told, mind has imagining quality; that should not be considered as an ordinary quality.  It is an amazing creative power.  Using this only, in this world also, people have achieved so many inventions and so many discoveries.  So, like this, it goes on and on.  It can go like that one.  It is possible.  

Mata Ambaji:   So Baba, I want to ask next question with the space; mind, consciousness and space, are they three different things?  Because neither mind nor the space nor consciousness can be explained, because all three are so infinite that you cannot see through naked eyes, or you cannot present, or can they be perceived again by the mind.  

Babaji Maharaj:   In my opinion, all the three are one and same.  In one entity all these capabilities are there.  Means, say, first we take the space.  Space is such a thing which can allow any matter to penetrate through its surface.  That is an amazing quality of the space.  No other matter can allow this.  Either the matter will have to be destroyed, or it has to be cut into pieces, something like that.  But the space, without getting harmed, it can allow any matter to pass through its surface.  That is an amazing great quality.  And time also; it can allow any time.  It can show one hour into eight hours.  When you are sleeping, you are then and there itself.  If you are not getting sleep, in your mind the imagination starts happening as if it is ages.  For an inexperienced, new person who is totally new to spirituality, ask him to sit for one hour, “And after one hour, I will wake you up.”  That one hour could be such a torturesome hundred years of time.  That thousands of thoughts coming, coming, coming, coming and thinking, “God, when will Babaji tell the story, his sloka, when will he wake up?” Like this. That imagination makes them feel as if they are undergoing a hundred years of change type of thing.  So that is the effect of mind or the consciousness’s own imagination calculation.  

So thus, finally, mind, when it imagines, if that imagination is under control, and if it is fully aware, “This is only my imagination,” then the mind will not suffer from whatever it would imagine.  Otherwise, if it gets carried away with its imagination, it will suffer.  It will trap itself into that one.  Simple; in this world also, any daydream or you are watching a movie, you can allow your consciousness to get sucked into it.  Once it is sucked, it can get trapped into its own creation, start considering that to be a reality, and undergo all good, bad, panic, fear, happiness, excitement, everything keeps happening.  It seems it is uncontrollable.  Today, this world, whatever it is creating within the uncontrolled minds of all the happiness, unhappiness, good, bad, suffering, this, that, so many things, it appears that our mind is trapped into this creation.  It is trapped and it is unable to get out of this.  Humanity is struggling.  That's what we try to teach this art of meditation; it is a very highly skilled, educative exercise, evolved since time immemorial in our Indian culture.  They gave it to us; generation after generation this is coming.  And that is how if you meditate, you can go back and experience the Truth, getting rid of all the things in one go.  

Mata Ambaji:   So Baba, according to Ramana Maharishi, when a yogi goes and attains Self-realization or Atmasakshatkaara, how would you explain to someone who has not experienced that status of aatma? Are the atman, space and consciousness three different things or again the same thing, but experienced by a yogi into the status of that awareness which exists, but exists beyond any time and space?

Babaji Maharaj:   That's what, if we try to go to the source itself. For example, there is the mind.  Repeatedly, when I teach, I keep telling people, everybody, all of you know you have a mind, but simply you know the mind that you have is based on the thoughts and visions that are in the mind.  But have you ever bothered to know what that mind itself is, how and why is it creating such havoc on us? “Why is that I am unable to have happiness all the 24 hours and 12 months in one go, why is this fluctuation?”  It is the same mind that is there.  That's how I used to think, “Is there something wrong in me or something wrong in this world or what has happened?”  That was the main, major thing, not any miracles, not anything else; that itself was the biggest miracle.  Because even Kabir Das talks in His song, “Mana pula pula fire jagatame, kaisa jaadudalare.”  “Such a wonder, this mind expanding puffed up, puffed up is wandering in this world aimlessly like a monkey.  What a great magician you are, what a great hypnotizer, can there be anything else?”

Mata Ambaji:   So, Baba, You answer very beautifully that again, it's the mind which imagines and because of its imagination, it sees whichever creation or whichever dimension it's seeing; it's seeing because of its own imagination.  But what is the status of an Atma Gnani or a Self-realized?  Because for me, from my naked eyes, I see You, I see You eating, walking, doing like an ordinary human being, but what is the status of Your mind?  Does Your mind exist like a vichaara, like a thought, or You exist in that consciousness which has reflection as a mind? 

Babaji Maharaj:   I would try to tell precisely.  When I use the mind, that mind will not register anything that it thinks as a reality.  It has obtained the expertise of the reality, what the truth is.  It simply uses to imagine, to give a clue, the nearest possible way for a seeker to go to that truth, advocating all that time, don't try to study every dimension.  It's mind-boggling and boundless, it's never ending.  Galaxies after Milky Ways, after galaxies, after Milky Ways, galaxy, you go on, go on.  If there is any intellectual, real intellectual mind, it will understand if we need to know the space, we have to become the space.  And nothing else can cover the space; when nothing else can cover the space, nothing else can ever understand what the space is.  

Mata Ambaji:   Baba, it's very mind-boggling again because You said “You have to become space.”  So, when you become space, where is God then? 

Babaji Maharaj:   All concepts end there, all dualities.  Any such concept is in duality only.  When you have imagined yourself as a small human being… see, imagine, on a huge planet called Earth, what would be the size of a six-foot human?  Just like a micro-speck sticking onto the Earth.  And we boast and boast of our powers and our thinking, anybody.  That's what whenever people ask about miracles, somebody creating something, I feel like laughing and what are they talking.  You just take a brick and hit on the head, it will break into two pieces.  What power are you talking?  Many people have even, my own brother disciples have criticized, “It seems that Swamiji has not given You any powers.”  What powers you wanted from Swamiji to be given to me?  If somebody is dancing, that is the power.  If somebody is quietly – all these people are sitting, that is also a power, if you consider; they are all have become fond of me.  They have fallen in love with me.  And they have developed some sort of respect.  That's why they are able to keep quiet and listen to us when we are talking this topic. So, where do you and how do you recognize power?  Power is not simply that you make somebody to dance; that itself is not a trance.  Anything can be bhaava in any way.  That's what it is.  

So that's what finally, becoming space itself means.  To tell, all the three entities appear only in dualities; when we have imagination about ourselves as a separated entity, then we adopt all these things.  A God concept or a space concept or a time concept, all these things we adopt.  Because we go on using these things, but every time we use – if you understand the time, for whatever we use the time concept, we limit the actual time.  Actual time is limitless.  

Mata Ambaji:   Yes, Baba.  Even scientifically, you cannot measure the time.  

Babaji Maharaj:   Measure the time at all.  It is totally boundless.  As boundless as the space.  So thus, space and time, both are same.  

Mata Ambaji:   So, Baba, You said again, space.  The scientific theory says that space is fully conscious and it reacts and it expands.  The galaxies are expanding.  So, the space is also expanding.  What do You say about that? 

Babaji Maharaj:   Instead of space, we need to understand, it is the consciousness.  Consciousness, when it expands, the matter also expands.  Just like in your mind, as we were talking, the mind itself is the combination of consciousness and energy.  When it spins and expands, the matter in the mind also expands.  Any story, its time limit, its characters, its size, everything expands as the consciousness expands.  For the same mind, I am using the word consciousness, because it is the consciousness which has the power, ability to be creative.  It happens only in imagination, and it is mind-boggling, limitless.  Sky is the limit.  Yet, compared to the space itself, that is also limited.  Imagination also gets limited there.  Only the space can measure the space; that we all agree.  So, nothing else can measure the space.  There is no duality which is equivalent to space, which can measure the space, which can understand the space, which can tell what is space.  Space is the Ultimate Truth.  Space is the Supreme Consciousness of existence.  This is what a yogi experiences in deeper samadhi state, that this space is not the space as we were told or as we are imagining it to be.  It is the Ultimate Truth.  It is the Brahmanda.  It is the Supreme Consciousness of existence.  

Mata Ambaji:   Baba, this is beautiful, because You said at the end, it is the Supreme Consciousness of existence.  So, Baba, this existence, how this existence, which is in the form of pure consciousness, takes the form of an object?  How this theory of object, even an object as a living being, because living being has created the non-living being also, means all this table, chair has been created by someone who is living.  So, how did this cycle start and what's the source? 

Babaji Maharaj:   You see, mind is the clue to explain in a logical way.  Space can never be demonstrated as it is, but you have to understand by using your intellectuality, by watching the mind.  Mind itself is like a space.  That is what I keep telling.  Nobody has seen the mind in their naked eyes.  They cannot show it to anybody's naked eyes also; “This is my mind.  This is the color of the mind.”  But you all know you have a mind.  But simply based on the things that are in the mind; then what the mind itself is?  That mind is the source for all the things that are in the mind.  Because all the things that are in the mind are impermanent.  It comes and goes, it keeps spinning, it comes and goes, it comes and goes.  Thus, mind cannot stop into one particular imagination ever.  It keeps changing.  

Every moment it keeps changing, then it builds up and knits a new story.  After some time when it is tired, it builds up a new story, it builds a new story.  That is the clue for all dimensions that are all happening.  The consciousness expanding, planets appearing, stars appearing, things happening, galaxies appearing.  So, with one solar system, within one star and one sun, one galaxy, few galaxies or few Milky Ways, throughout the humans are studying and studying, studying; a new exoplanet has appeared, a new star has appeared, everything has appeared.  But still, the source hasn't been touched yet.  

Mata Ambaji:   Yes.  That's one of the biggest mysteries Baba,  because, why am I asking, see, if God is fully conscious existence, and I am a part of that Divinity which exists, why did I separate from its consciousness?  What is the cause of this separation?  But there is a longing to go back also.  So, what's the secret?  How to go back? 

Babaji Maharaj:   One thing, there is no conclusive answer when and how it happened.  Perhaps to our observation, the presence of energy and a curiosity in the consciousness to experience certain things.  To experience itself, it had to become a second entity.  When it became a second entity, it couldn't have become the same entity as it is.  That is only one thing.  No second space of the same quality, same distance or same effect can ever come into existence.  There's only one space.  Beyond that there cannot be any other space to tell that “Our space is this distance, there is another space;” there is no such thing.  In truth, there is only one space.  Within that one space, all dimensions are all happening.  Everything happening.  So, when it comes into duality, then only it can realize its own existence.  That's when that God concept came.  When it was miserable, it wanted to get rid of this.  It felt trapped.  “Some bondage is there, why is that happiness not coming?”  “Knowingly or unknowingly,” Ramana Maharishi said, “everybody is looking for happiness only.”  If the path is not right, the matter delays and they will be trapped again and again.  If they are able to take the right path, if they find the right Master and the Master guides, so for this the highest things can be guided.  See, so that's how we can go for that one.  

So, instead of getting excited by the things that are in the mind, if you can little bit also try to understand or think about the mind, it will be such a hair-raising effect, that day.  That's what I keep telling, “You are the greatest wonder.  You are the source of peace.”  So, the mind is the greatest wonder which can give rise to so much in the mind, stories, beautiful things that are in the mind.  So, imagine the capacity of that mind.  

Mata Ambaji:   And Baba, You always say that the consciousness is fully energetic.  The consciousness and energy are not two separate things.  The consciousness itself is energetic.  And you recognize it when it's in the movement.  You recognize it as an energy.  So, here my question is, Baba, You very beautifully answered already, but I just want to expand a little bit more.  Consciousness, which is one mass, I can say space or existence, so my existence is not separate.  My existence is the same existence, which is this Supreme Consciousness energy.  But because of my own mind, I am in the duality and I suffer the pain, I suffer the unhappiness, I suffer the age, I suffer the decaying of the body, everything.  Whereas, this consciousness is purely awakened, purely fully energetic and has nothing to do with me.  And I am unnecessarily trapped. 

Babaji Maharaj:   Simply in illusion.  

Mata Ambaji:   Simply in illusion.  

Babaji Maharaj:   You are sitting.  A movie is going on its own.  Let it go.  But you get trapped by getting sucked into it and you are so much affected.  A villain could be so threatening.  That is the example we can give, the nearest, as soon as possible.  Any such appearance, imagine its potency and the megapixels of the picture, compared to this, the creation, you cannot measure the megapixels or the potency of the creation.  That's what is the hair-raising.  

Mata Ambaji:   Absolutely.  I feel like crying.  

Babaji Maharaj:   We keep talking.  That’s what I was telling, today's question is so beautiful.  I am feeling that...  

Mata Ambaji:  Thrill.

Babaji Maharaj: Thrill, and that experience we had.  What sorts of miracles we are talking of? When this is happening, can there be anything bigger than this?  That's why Ramana Maharishi told “If that’s a miracle, everything is a miracle.”  Simply that it's happening is a miracle.  You, yourself, is the greatest miracle, how you exist.

Mata Ambaji:   Thank You so much Babaji.  My prostrations at Your lotus feet. 

Question:   Pranaam Babaji.  You mentioned that when there are a lot of thoughts, maybe for someone new in meditation, it could seem like the meditation takes a very long time.  Is the opposite also true that as there are fewer thoughts, the time becomes less because the only object we are aware of in meditation is the thoughts?  So, the space between the thoughts affects our understanding or perception of time in that state?

Babaji Maharaj:   Yeah, definitely it decreases.  That is the only technique, not to get involved with the thoughts that appear, which are already there in the mind as an acquired habit there.  Since time immemorial it had been there.  Simply, to get rid of that don't get involved with that.  Watch that.  Then it all starts dissolving; one by one thoughts go.  Then the time gap.  Now, the reverse thing.  Time gap on the space increases and time gap on the thoughts all decrease.  So, that's how when you go to the space time gap, the time transcends itself to the highest consciousness.  That's how the mind gets purified and all thoughts and visions which could be corrupting the mind all disappear.  

Same Questioner:   And when we're watching in meditation, there's the gap between the thoughts, but that space is also present even when the thoughts are there if we just keep watching, right? 

Babaji Maharaj:   It is present.  But seldom your attention goes to that.  It is there within you, actually.  But you are unable to notice that when you are too strongly attracted to the thought.  Two are there; which one attracts you, space or this hand [pointing to His hand].  Like that.  So, once you understand the value of space; the space which gives peace.  Peace is only when it is space, means when there is nothing, no thoughts are there.  Supremely.  Awareness also is only when other thoughts all disappear, only that space is there.  So, these are the values that you understand.  Thus, gradually yourself is revealed to yourself and you start understanding you are not simply the body, you are not simply a limited thing, you are that space itself.  

Same Questioner:   And You were also talking with Ambaji about how incredible it is to even be a little bit aware of it.  Maybe it would seem like initially if someone thought about tapas, they would say, “O, it seems like such a long time, twelve years or something.”  But I would guess that as you experience how amazing that is, your perspective would change, that it would be such a thrilling thing to be aware of.

Babaji Maharaj:   Yeah, you see, when a yogi does His tapas, He transcends all this imagined time and space.  Then as He gets closer to the Ultimate Truth, He loses His individual, imagined self also.  Then when the merger happens; when the merger happens, all this thrill, everything ends there, all experiences end, all ideas are dropped completely.  It simply settles to itself.  So, today as Ambaji raised this question with her intelligent act, so I could recall what happens.  That spontaneously came.  As it was coming, then I felt the thrill also.  That is what I was telling – I felt the voice choked.  Means when we compare, we keep talking of mystic things, miracles in this world.  In all these fifty years of my sojourn of spirituality, I was never attracted to these things; wanted the knowledge of the Ultimate Truth, jnana, bhakti, vairagya all the time, so thus never anything attracted.  But still, people are attracted to these things so quickly, so small things.  When such a bigger thing is there waiting for you, a whole chocolate mall, supermarket the Divine wants to give you; you are just asking for a chocolate.  

Question:   Some science theories have said that the past, present and future are occurring simultaneously at the same time, and thus our life is already predetermined by the universe.  This means our future has already been planned by the universe, and cannot change the incidents happening in our life, be it good or bad.  Ramana Maharishi has also said that we will receive things, we will meet people and circumstances in our life as determined by the universe.  We cannot change that, but what we can change is that our thought processes and the mind towards the predetermined incidents in our life.  Ramana Maharishi has also said that if something is not meant for us, no matter how much we put in effort, we will not receive it.  And the things and incidents that we are meant to encounter will happen no matter how hard we try to avoid.  Is it true that we cannot change time, Babaji?  If every incident in our life is already predetermined and planned by the Divinity, what is the purpose of time and space? 

Babaji Maharaj:   It is true, what Ramana Maharishi has told is the truth, but to adopt in everybody's life, for many people it could be confusing.  ‘Whatever we have to get, we are going to get’; that doesn't mean that we simply sit in a corner and leave it, so “That is all we are going to get and we have to settle this was all we were meant to get.”  That happens.  So, if we don't get up and prepare our food to eat, instead if we keep sitting, “Whatever we are supposed to get, we are going to get” – if we don't get the food, we have to settle down, “So this was all we were meant for, not to get food today.”  Are you ready to accept this truth?  Then you do whatever you want to do.  This one must understand.  That's why repeatedly I keep telling, Advaita is not easy to adopt and work by a theory, questions.  It can be multi-meaning.  Ramana Maharishi, whatever He has said is truth.  That is not to be discussed, tried to understand before we work out, we put an effort.  Simply, whatever you want, you put an effort.  Finally, that's fine.  Whatever happens, that's it.  So that's what we have to take.  

So that's how we have to take so that, under any circumstances, our mind doesn't jump into a craving.  That craving is what needs to be stopped.  That's all.  You don't have to have a craving, “I must have this.  If it doesn't happen, I'm not going to be.”  There is no such thing.  We try to have it.  If it happens, it happens.  If it doesn't happen, it doesn't happen.  Then this theory; whatever we were meant to get, we are getting – that is happening every day.  Whatever we are meant to be working also, we are working.  That also, we must understand – in Advaita; this is all in Advaita.  Just like Ramakrishna said, “You forgot the elephant rider, but you tried to think about God only in the elephant, idiot.”  The Master scolds.  That's why by reading this theory, one must not misunderstand.  ‘Whatever we have to get, we will get that much’, is only after putting an effort.  

Question:   Thank You, Babaji.  I would like to ask if the mind and the consciousness is the same entity.  I think Baba has already spoken about this.  And who or what creates the illusion?  Is it a different entity, or is it the mind itself? 

Babaji Maharaj:   It is when the mind was in its 100,000 potency.  Every time it has incarnated, it has scattered, diluted.  So, for example, when the present mind of all of you, when it was with its 100,000 potency, whatever it had resolved, that could have become the destiny of the present.  That destiny would be difficult for this mind to handle.  But the same mind, potency was different, strength was there, concentration.  So, to go back to that higher consciousness, you have to make this mind gain the same potency.  So, for that, stop thinking, transcend all thoughts, become quiet, become quiet.  That is the idea of meditation teaching, so that it can take you back there, and you will realize.  

Question:   So, Babaji, in tapas, Baba gained that maximum potency of consciousness? 

Babaji Maharaj:   Yeah.  You have to gain that.  Finally, merger with the Ultimate Truth means, how much of vairagya, is the word, detachment.  Detachment to anything else that may come on the way to tempt you, “Here is this thing, you take this one.  Let that one be, it is dry.”  Many teachers, they want to colorfully talk, they tell “the actual truth is very dry”.  I tell, they don't know the actual truth at all.  It's very dry when you start missing something in the mind.  You are used to gossiping, and you will be asked to sit alone here, and nothing, no cell phone will be given to you, nothing.  Then you will feel bored “O God, I needed to talk to somebody.”  This beautiful hall, meditation hall can make you miserable if you are habitual to that one.  So, like that, when you are habitual, you want to do that one.  Otherwise, when you become actually peaceful, when no imagination comes, the imagination of wanting to talk, gossip, everything disappears.  So, where is the dryness? 

Question:   Thank You, Babaji.  Pranaams Babaji.  Going back to the concept of space and time, there is a saying by, I think it's by Albert Einstein, he says that “The universe is fundamentally timeless.”  I think when Baba explained about space as boundless and an infinite entity, it's easier to grasp the concept, but when you say it is timeless, how do we understand this?  

Babaji Maharaj:   One important thing, if you want to take into account how this universe came into existence and when, nobody really knows.  When it is going to come to an end also, nobody knows.  It can come to an end tomorrow, or it can go on for a billion years, nobody knows.  Maybe another earth will come into existence, something else.  This is a mind-boggling thing.  So, based on this only, the universe is also timeless, some schools think.  But, if the seeker is for a supreme peace and Self-realization, do not bother about the time limits or the timelessness of this universe.  Instead, go for the timelessness of that thing from where the actual time arose.  That is the final truth, the recommended goal for supreme peace once for all.  Otherwise, this universe can make you mind-boggled all the time.  This is an illusion.  It is happening, simply.  Wheel of hypnotizing effect is moving, moving, moving.  

Same Questioner:   So, Baba, is there is a point to understand the universe, how it works?

Babaji Maharaj:   Impossible.  That's when I told, we as a human being, if you try to imagine the planet earth and the solar system, if you are an astronomer, you look into the astronomer atlas things also, hundreds of dots in a paper, how much they can show?  Then they will put an arrow, “Somewhere here is our solar system.”  Imagine.  And we are dancing on this, “This pillar is mine.  This house is mine.  And this earth is mine.”  You are just a six-foot human being on this earth.  How much you are doing? Where we stand? 

Mata Ambaji:   So, Baba, it's contradictory a little bit.  I'll say here that You said there is no need to study the universe.  But all those scientific theories also have been done or these discoveries were done by the study of the universe only.  There are mathematical studies, scientific studies.  And today the human being sitting on the earth has the knowledge how to go to the space.  And that's where they have realized that the time onto the earth and the time onto the space has no meaning.  It means time is ultimately an imagination.  

Babaji Maharaj:   Yeah, let us agree, it is sensible.  But what we are trying to teach; two things are there.  One is, whatever illusion is there, go on studying about that illusion.  That itself is a mind-boggling thing, never-ending process.  You can study and study and study, new-new stars coming, new-new planets appearing, new Milky Ways coming, sometimes black holes appearing, sometimes black substances happening.  Recently we saw a theory.  There are two black substances.  One is such a black substance which makes a galaxy disappear.  And another black substance which makes a galaxy appear.  So, such wonders are always there.  There is no dearth of it.  You can be born a hundred thousand times, go on being born again and again, study on this.  All these are there.  To whomever this is exciting, they can study.  But side-by-side, have you ever thought of the source of all this?  What itself it is.  So, all these things are there.  

So, that is what; a sanctum sanctorum, we come to temple, we see the maha dwara [main gate/door], we see the compound wall, we see the pillar.  Finally, we want to come and see the sanctum sanctorum, garbha gudi, actual Divinity.  So, that's what our school of thought, philosophy in Indian culture taught that you go for the Ultimate Truth.  Not for all the play that's being here, because this is a never-ending thing.  You can keep playing.  All the toys; all the solar systems and milky ways and everything is like toys.  You can go on playing.  The space is playing these toys.  For us it is amazing, everything.  Anything you can go on trying to know.  So, when you try to know the source, you come across another.  When you try to know the source of that you come across another.  So, you are misunderstanding that everything is coming through such a source which you can comprehend by an instrument that you can invent or discover, which is not so.  They are going with the same thing.  So, like our school teaches to go for Self-realization, that truth is you yourself.  How you are playing.  You need to have control over yourself.  Otherwise, things can be dangerous.  

Mata Ambaji:   I understood Baba that You are telling that the silencing of the mind is the ultimate and it's the source.  

Babaji Maharaj:   So, imagine the nature's amazing things; when the nuclear bomb, nuclear energies were discovered.  But the same nuclear energy, if it is not under control, what it can do for humanity or the creatures of this world – havoc, if any unnatural, untrained, evil or corrupted, selfish, cannot understand presses the button, what can happen?  That is also discussed.  So, like this, the killing button is always with the Ultimate Source.  

Mata Ambaji:   Baba, there is one thing where I'll do contradictory comment here, because I say that scientific discoveries are amazing.  And people who go for this, they are ultimately going in the search of the truth, means they go.  

 Babaji Maharaj:   Definitely amazing; I am agreeing, everything is amazing.  It is a thrill.  When you see the Milky Way or the solar system, earth rotating on its axis and it's coming around the sun, which has given us the life on this earth.  So, the same energy is working.  It's an amazing thing, it has made it.  This all happens.  Along with that, one opportunity – this is the greatness of our sages of those great masters like Krishna who taught.  This time limit is there for this body.  It has appeared and it will die.  So, before death shall claim thee, know that truth.  Go to the knowers of that truth from where everything has emerged.  So, this also needs to be bothered.  So, that's why the West's science, the Eastern philosophy, if both can go together, then humanity can have peace and harmony.  This is what is missing.  It is necessary that we should work for peace and harmony.  Simply excited, creating, never ending is happening.  

Question:   Babaji, in Judea-Christian tradition, God is the God of love.  What is left of love in the space of silence?  What is left of love in non-duality in the space of silence? 

Babaji Maharaj:   When in the space of silence only One is there.  There is no duality there.  Love merges.  So, when a duality comes, that love also is given so that you can finally merge.  That's why love needs to be unconditional.  Otherwise, love, if it is conditional, that always creates lust and greed.  That's when people fight.  In the beginning, they tell, “We love each other”, “I love you”, “O sunny,” this, that, everything.  But they cannot get along for twenty-four hours, they start fighting.  Where is the love?  If the real love is there, they will live as one.  Two people can live one.  It can bind people into togetherness.  If all humans love for each other, it can bind.  So, that is the play of the love.  

Question:   Pranaams, Babaji.  Can You speak to the state of mind in dreamless deep state?  Is the mind still in duality? 

Babaji Maharaj:   Yes.  Because in a deep sleep, the brain has gone into a deep sleep.  Not even smallest activity is there.  That's why dreams are also not getting created.  But the mind itself is not yet purified.  Simply, it is unable to catch any reflection.  That's why it is unconscious of the body and the world.  But it is there.  So, as soon as the brain comes into activity, it will get stuck to the brain's reflection and the mind also starts spinning.  

End of Questions and Answers

Babaji Maharaj now concludes:

   So, very wonderful topic and questions came up, Ambaji and all other team members.

End of Session

SUMMARY

Babaji Maharaj discusses the nature of time, space, mind, and consciousness. He explains that time and space are mental constructs useful for worldly functioning but dissolve with Self‑realization. Through philosophical dialogue, stories, and analogies to science, He emphasizes illusion, imagination, and duality as products of the mind, and teaches meditation as the path to transcend them and realize the non‑dual Ultimate Truth